Last year when I was looking at 100+ year old homes, over two hours away from Boston, that were 800 SQ ft. 2 bd 1 baths with crumbling foundations, the monthly mortgage payment would have been around $2,500 (Not counting all the maintenance and homeowning costs).

All to say, $5-6 k for a Boston adjacent neighborhood seems correct.

The solution for these situations always seems the same to me; try different neighborhoods. I couldn't afford to live in JP next to a T station, or in Southie. But I got a SFH in Roslindale on a bus line with a little backyard on a pretty quiet street. Needed a new kitchen, bathroom and heating system, but the foundation and the roof were super solid. And I love my little house.

Did those homes have solid gold walls or something? Because what you’re describing doesn’t make sense otherwise.

Maybe the market has shifted in the past year, but these were just basic ass old homes.

Put multiple offers over asking price and waiving inspections, and couldn't snag one. They were very rural, no fluff.

The only positive factor I could imagine, is that they came with a small patch of land instead of being a small yarded suburban home.

$2100, 2 bedroom single family house, 15 mins to boston.

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Do people even understand that 5K-6K would buy for a home? I don't understand why people are paying that to rent.

If they can afford that to rent, what are they doing for work? They are blowing their money away paying this. Find a house and your mortgage is money in the bank, it is YOUR MONEY not a landlords.

Should we hide our interest rates.... ?

https://redf.in/Msfzl5. This one here is like 3k, assuming 20% down, 30 year fixed, 4.5% rate... Including taxes etc.

$2900 3b/1.5ba 1200 sqft in Wollaston. 3% mortgage.

Ended up in Hyde Park as probably a 4th-choice neighborhood, 1200sf 3bd, pay $2500/mo all in. Bundled home/auto insurance for further savings. House needed a lot of basic cosmetic repair (pulled up carpeting, wood paneling) New kitchen and new boiler probably in about 5 -7 years. Could not be happier with the community and the location.

Eh, depends on where they want to live. If they can easily afford 5k in rent i don’t think it really matters to them to have a property.

Also 5k rent gets you a much nicer place than 5k mortgage, especially right now with high interest rates.

My personal uninformed opinion is that young professionals with lots of money don't want to live in older houses in outer neighborhoods with charming elderly folks as neighbors.

You’re going to need at least 200k down payment on a 5-6K/month mortgage. That’s a pretty big hurdle.

Down payment? Interest rate? Location? So much important detail left out

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Very similar story here. Couldn’t afford Davis so came to Rozzy. My place was updated but I redid the basement and made some other minor improvements. I have a good size yard, driveway, and garage. Rozzy rules.

OMG the wood paneling. Forgot to mention that. My first floor was covered it in. One of the bedrooms still is. 😁

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I'm curious where OP got $5000/mo figure from, i'm in a 1600sf 3bd in dedham and it's abot $2800/mo... I know my payment would be a lot worse at market rate (bought summer '21) but I still don't see anywhere near 5k/month

Two hours from Boston, 800 square feet, $375,000?

For that price it better have a few acres of very nice land.

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I bought in late 2020 in Watertown. $3900/ month is my total payment. 3.125% interest rate. I bought a two family home and rent out one unit for $2200/ month. So my portion of the mortgage is $1700/ month.

It's a house that hadn't had any improvements or preventative maintenance in 20 years and no updates in 50 years. We've already put in about $150k (before incentives/ rebates) into it.

All that is public info. Just need last name or address

Kinda makes me feel better about paying $2,100/mo in rent for a three bdrm, 1 bath, w/d, in quincy. At least I don’t have to mow/plow or suddenly have to buy a new water heater. Or worry about crumbling foundations. I write one check a month & don’t worry about a thing.

Well last summer mortgage rates were close to 0. 2% is a big difference from the. 7-8 it is today.

How did you fund the $150k? Is that something you are paying for on top of the $3,900?

Bought a 1 br condo in Malden in 2021, paying around $2000 a month on it.

I don't know what to tell you.

We put in offers in the $300,000 price range, offering $40k over asking, and often got ghosted because someone else was willing to pay full in cash days after it was listed.

Not new homes. Old homes with small plots.

It's one thing to look on Redfin for shits and giggles, it's another thing to actually be going to open houses and making offers every weekend. Downvotes welcome.

My house was 3600 a month when I bought it last summer. Now for the same mortgage it would be 5000/month.

Have you seen current average rates? While they have come down they are sitting around 6.5%

You can get a mortgage that includes money for renovations, so it’s one payment lumped into your mortgage. Like the Fannie Mae HomeStyle Removation mortgage for example. Or an FHA 203k loan is for first time home buyers that includes reno, though there’s a lot of hoops you have to jump through for those since it’s a government program and needs HUD approval

All these people quoting rates at 3% and 4% the current average is around 6.5%. So let’s use that number.

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Of course. I was asking about that particular case.

I haven’t up or downvoted your posts.

I don’t know where you were looking 2 hours from Boston and seeing that. I know the real estate in that area (Boston north) and you can find better homes 2 hours north for less than that

We were looking anywhere north, east or west, of Boston (family is scattered in the area). As far as Keene or southern Maine. Just wanted a modest home that had good internet (I work remotely in media and need the bandwidth).

We put in offer, after offer, over asking for a year, pretty much every weekend, and got nothing. So again, I don't know what to tell you.

We were putting offers on really shit houses listed at $200k, for $250k, knowing that we would bite the bullet in renovations. And still, Someone would either offer more, or just pay in cash. This was every weekend.

A variety of ways. When we first moved in we realized the roof leaked. A lot. In about a dozen different places that we could see. We paid about 50% of the roof replacement in cash and then put the rest of it on a 0% interest credit card for 14 months, paid the minimum for 14 months then paid it off.

We got a mass save energy audit which allowed us to access a HEAT loan, which is a $25k loan, paid back over 7 years with 0% interest to upgrade our heating system.

Those are the only two things we've used to finance.

Big However. We also both got promotions with 10-12% salary increases shortly after we closed. Being double income, no kids, with only a $1700 payment allowed us to save a lot over about 2 years. It's only in the last 2 months that we upgraded the heating systems and added solar (used the heat loan and paid cash for everything else, but we'll get about $37k back from rebates and tax credits). There's been other things we've done that combined is $$$ but that's been spread out over the last two years so doesn't feel like $$$.

Last spring so low rates, 3k/month for a 1300sf 3/1 inside 128

Lexington, Arlington, Needham, etc are what OP is probably referring to. 5k is about 800k-1mil house.

This logic is deeply flawed.

At this point a mortgage on a $1m house is >5k. Buying a $1m home will cost at least 7% ($70k) in transaction costs to buy and sell. Ignore that you need $200k down, cost of interest, opportunity cost of that money, maintenance, location considerations, etc. You’d still need to live in the house for years to even begin for it to makes sense vs renting.

Renting is not throwing your money away.

Thanks for the comprehensive reply! Good luck!

Interesting question. Seemed to me that there was a final frenzy of inflated prices over the summer as people rushed to lock in rates they knew were going up.

The fed wants to crush the housing market so who is braving it to buy right now?

My mortgage would be 50% higher with current rates (bought in 2019). I can’t imagine someone paying nearly 2x (what it would be with the Redfin estimated price and current rates)

I'm paying way less, 5k would be unsustainable. But I got the mortgage before the rate picked up.

If you don't like wood paneling, you probably don't appreciate rich Corinthian leather

The garbage sitting on the market right now is INSANE. The interest rate hikes have barely put a dent in the housing prices around here. Which I guess is an issue when the Fed only has one tool and it’s a sledgehammer that impacts LCOL markets way more than the coasts. The lcol markets are hurting and the coasts barely see a blip. And then the cycle of ever increasing housing continues.

That’s awesome! You should add when you bought though, so people don’t have false hope

Who said anything about million dollar homes? But, it fits your example so I guess you decided to use it.

And yes renting is a sucker deal

My 3 bed 2 bath luxury apartment in Everett was $5000 a month plus beautiful amenities . Then bought a home 45 mins south of Boston for $3300 a month .. 3 bed 2 1/2 bath plus in law apartment with 1 bed 1 bath kitchen living room area. Braintree apartment was about $2000 a month 1 bed 1 bath plus amenities. Haverhill penthouse was 2 bed 1 1/2 bath plus amenities $2300. Malden duplex was 3 bad 2 bath for about $2000.

Our total per month is $4007 in Arlington. We bought last August though so got the rock bottom interest rates…

EDIT: I just calculated it and we would be paying $6400 per month with todays interest rates. Yeesh, glad we got in when we did, I’m so sorry you guys.

We pay $4900 which includes tax, mortgage, principal and interest. It’s not ideal but it’s better than renting!

Edit: Charlestown 2+ bed, 2 bath, with parking.

If you don't have school age kids - probably ideal.

That is crazy high. Boston has a resident exemption and i live in my condo so my taxes for a 2bed/2bath in JP (1150+ sq feet) work out to about $10k annually.

Your taxes with the residential exemption are 10k? That seems really high. I own a house and my taxes with the exemption are about $1600.

Think it depends what you have for a downpayment. I sold some stock off before the COVID crash and held in cash since, and have toned down how much I'm throwing in the market given how topsy turvy it is. Just watching to see at what point people start cutting prices for condos- I can tolerate a higher interest rate if they come down enough since I have a pretty healthy downpayment ready.

In short, if you're buying right now you're doing it in cash. Although point taken on braving it- even if you have cash, it's a waiting game since I don't think we're anywhere close to bottoming out on any price cuts. I'm slowly starting to see them now- seems people just let stuff sit on the market for longer and longer and have been avoiding price cuts. We'll see if/when any cuts become more than just a trickle

Yes, and thats if your credit is over 800.

North or Worcester east of 190. Think Phillipston. Thats about where your price range is going to take you.

I have 2 school aged kids in BPS. No complaints.

Yes. And It's 1600 sq feet with 4 beds and 3 baths, thank you.

Almost like there's a reason people like the coasts...

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That's way low.

Lowell, 2200 SQ ft, 4 bedrooms, $4.2k piti.

Lowell is not a bad place. Not too many shooting at traffic incidents...

Why not buy now and refi when they go down?

$2300 3b/2ba 1500 sqft in Weymouth

I do not think it’s an us vs them issue. It’s just that using a blunt instrument like monetary policy on the housing markets has unintended and unequal consequences. In total $$$, higher cost of housing areas are impacted much more both positively and negatively.

Currently in the home buying market and the math of interest rates is really the driving factor. For example, the payment on a $600,000 mortgage at 7% interest rate is more or less the same as the payment on a $950,000 mortgage at 3%.

I have friends that are locked in below 2%. At that rate, a $1.1mil mortgage is the same payment as described above.

Should've said so.

Your account says "Somerville" on it. I assume by fifteen minutes that's no longer where you live?

Considering Dedham quie literally a "boston adjacent suburb" as well as adjacent to Needham, i'm not sure how OP couldn't be referring to Dedham.

No we aren't cool with it, but that's just a reality of the market right now. Prices across the board have been inflating like crazy (in and out of the housing market), and the federal reserve has been jacking up interest rates to combat inflation. This is going to have an effect on the interest rates you can get on mortgages, which is making housing historically expensive right now. There are of course other problems with housing, but this is one of the worst times to be buying real estate right now. You will basically guarantee you need to refinance later on because these interest rates will eat your cash up.

There are of course other cheaper neighborhoods, but imo I would avoid buying a home at all until interest rates drop to a more reasonable level. This is especially true if your credit isn't amazing.

A few reasons:

1. You probably can't afford it right now
2. If you can only afford it for a while but not sustainably, you run a big risk of getting foreclosed on before the market normalizes
3. Your financial situation (credit, etc) might change and refinancing later may not be as fruitful as you think
4. Your asset is very likely to reduce in value (at least relative to the overall market) if you're expecting prices to drop
5. Always buy low, sell high, never buy high unless you have to. Even if you're not selling, your heirs might need to.

Same boat as you, what a fun year it's been knowing that I might as well have sprung for my $800k dream home in February because now I'll spend the same on a $550k split level. 🤦‍♀️

How much did you put down?

Fuckkkk

At 4.5% with accurate property tax rates that property comes out to 3350 a month minimum.

Also, don't forget you're buying a $628,000 property which doesn't have a dishwasher inside of it.

This place also went contingent, was back on the market two days later, and had a 10k price drop. That's... totally fine, right?

Also, 4.5% interest rates don't exist right now. Even with "great credit".

I bought our two-family (with a 3 car garage) in Somerville a decade ago.

When interest rates were low, took out a sizable HELOC to do some renovations and then rolled the HELOC and the mortgage into a new loan. Got it all refinanced at 1.875% on a 20 year loan vs. 30 year.

It helped that home values were through the roof because then what’s left on the mortgage is much lower and that lowers your rates.

All in comes to ~$3500/month now.

Wow. Are you sure? Lol. I really like Charlestown though. Good spot.

A lot but not too bad for Arlington. I'm in the heights and thank goodness it's a house my husband's parents gave us. All our neighbors sold in the last 3 years- like every single one.

They could also stop these massive spending bills. And naming one of them "inflation reduction bill" was just insulting.

Yeah Dedham has a significant border with Boston proper but this sub is predominantly north of Boston so if doesn't get mentioned frequently, like Milton and Canton (large and small borders with Boston proper, respectfully). Quincy I think is big enough it is still mentioned quite a bit.

You mean locked in below 3%? I've heard of some crazy low rates but I haven't heard anyone UNDER 2%. Maybe if they have something like an ARM or 15 year but even then I haven't seen that.

No that's very high.

I bought in Newton and will just say that I have small heart attack every single month on the first

Edit: I guess the more relevant thing to add is that I know I paid 15% too much for the house because of the market, but also plan to live there 20+ years so I kind of assume it will not be so significant in the long run.

Oh yeah. I have one friend locked in at 2.4% and another locked in at 1.8%. It hurts my soul thinking about it

I mean, i threw that house out there as an example... your point about rates is well taken, but they are on the the decline.

It's not impossible to be close to 3k a month, all in. The OP was saying a minimum of 5-6k... which is simply not true.

In order to get 1.8% APR 30 year fixed they would have needed to pay points. The lowest it ever hit was 2.5%. Again, unless they have a balloon payment, ARM, or something weird, but definitely not standard 30 year fix. Or they're lying/misinformed.

interesting, where do you get the impression this sub is predominantly north of Boston? I've never heard or noticed that before. And if that's the case, why are literally none of the other top responses (Roslindale, Hyde Park, Lexington, Needham) on the north shore? your assertion doesn't really hold up at all

Sry, I am assuming 20% and zero or 1 point interest 30yr fixed (so like high 6s). Locations listed in the post.

"Last summer" denotes jun-sept 2022, no?

Edit: shocked that this is indeed not the case.

what was the purchase price?

$500-550k range, 1930s house that needed decent work

He did

I think the answer tot his question comes down to are you financially ready to purchase. You can always refi in a couple yrs down the road. It’s much better than overbidding and paying crazy price with so little option. If you have any question. I can help. I’m a local realtor around Boston.

Something doesn't add up. Our house is assessed at 1.2 million and our taxes are 9K.

For a first time home buyer, you dont have to put down 20%. You can do 5 or 10%. A $5000 mortgage is basically a milion dollar home. So, if we arent talking that kind of house, lets be more realistic and say mortgages between 2000 and 3500 depending on down payment and price. A $500k house at 4.5 no down payment has a mortgage of about $2500.

So, OP was getting outbid because it was a sellers market. And most likely competing with developers who have cash.

$10k? That seems really high. After the residential exemption my property taxes on my 2 bed 1 bath in West Roxbury was (sold it a few months ago) $600/year.

Oh my bad I didn't see it.

We just bought our house near Quincy Center in October ‘22 - not a SFH by choice, but a 1600 sq ft 3 bed/2.5 bath townhouse with a garage and two off-street dedicated parking spots. We put down 10% and pay $5.2k a month at 5.5% for a 15 year mortgage.

I’m not cool with it, but it is what it is. We will have it paid off before we retire and that’s what matters.

$5000/month is around 750k with 20% down with rates in the high 6s. Depends on if it's a rez exemption town too.

Yea I misspoke in my initial post and said "last summer." Meant to say " this past summer." So meaning summer 2022 not 2021.

"Westfjord". $3950 piti. ~3kft 4 bd 2.5 ba MCM on more than 2 acres. Got lucky.AF with the best interest rate in history a few years ago.

I ended up in Roslindale after originally planning to move to JP as well. This was way back in 2011 and I was going to get a 1 BR apartment in JP but realized (it was a buyers market at the time) that I could buy for not much more than I would be paying in rent for a 1 BR. I bought a 3 BR SFH and I pay less for my mortgage (with taxes and insurance escrowed in) than most people pay for a 1 BR apartment these days.

Dude $750k with 20% down is a $600k financed mortgage. At 6% thats about $3,650. Where yall getting your numbers from??? I just used a mortgages calculator. Id add more to that for Insurance which is about 2400per year.

A mortgage and house is not unobtainable in the boston area.

I noticed that you used yall. Please enjoy this local video.

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If you educate yourself on the Feds monetary policy you would understand that federal spending bills are not what is impacting housing prices and housing interest rates.

Jumbo rates are different from confirming loan rates.

2500 for 1700 sq ft 3/1.5 in central MA purchased Oct 2021 at 2.75% fixed 30. Feel like we definitely overpaid by 20-30K, but looking at rents now, I’m happy we pulled the trigger. Fed is on a mission to restore credibility even though MoM inflation numbers indicate we’ve seen inflation peak. I think rates should come down back half of 2023 or early 2024 🤞

They are certainly affecting inflation which is the only thing I said.

Mortgage rates are more like 7%, bringing payments to 4k without taxes, insurance, and HOA. 5k is not far off. The median household income is 77k, which isn’t close to being able to afford a 4k payment (or even the 3.6k you mentioned), let alone save for the 150k down payment you’re implying. Houses in good areas are obtainable if you’re well off or are gifted money.

Sorry, middle of 2020.

Why im up no idea lol.. If you are not well off then you aren't buying in any current "good" areas no matter what. Stop using strawmen though. Use your situation... i bought in Dorchester when cabs didnt want to take you home from downtown at night. Now its one of the places to move to. I went through NACA for homebuyers assistance and workshops and put down 5% FHA loan. If i were buying right now, i couldnt afford my own house. I'd buy in Randolph, Brockton, Weymouth, Lynn, Saugus, Everett, etc All withn 30 minutes of Boston.

Many current "good" areas were not ao great areas before. When you dont have the resources, you do what ya gotta do.

A Couple making the median salary is $154k. They could get a 500-600k house with a commute. Or better yet get a 2 family that needs some TLC and the rental Income goes towards the mortgage.

> If you are not well off then you aren’t buying in any current “good” areas no matter what

Right, so it’s not “obtainable” like you said.

My situation is not normal. I make over 3x the median household income as an individual. Of course a house is obtainable for me. You don’t know what a straw man is or you wouldn’t have accused me of using one. The median salary is not made up.

77k is the median household income, not individual salary. The median Boston salary is 39k. So the couple you’re talking about making 154k consists of two people each making double the median salary.

It may be 15 year loan then it would make sense

how much did your house go for?

How much did your house go for?

What was the price for your house?

How much was the house listed for?

What’s the deal with public schools in Hyde park? Is it Boston school system? If so, does that mean your kids could end up getting bussed anywhere in the city? How does that work. Do you feel safe walking alone at night in your area?

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You are in one of the most desirable towns in the state. You’ll be fine. Your house will always appreciate.

875

I’m not sure why you’re being downvoted. It has never been a political issue policy to say that both fiscal and monetary policy have both impacted inflation rates.

I got 2.25 with a jumbo - not sure about below 2 ha

The feds monetary policy and federal spending bills have nothing to do with each other. The Fed is a private institution not controlled by government policy. Spending bills impact inflation in different ways, generally more spending is correlated with inflation. For example, spendy fiscal policy increases M2 velocity which correlates to a slight uptick in CPI.

E: to address the “if you educate yourself” comment I have a masters in this stuff and was taught by one of the preeminent monetary theorists in the world so hopefully that covers it.

I just have you neighborhoods where the dream is obtainable. You can ignore that if you want. Buying in Newton may not be obtainable but Randolph is.

FYI poor people aren't buying houses in Boston or much anywhere for that matter. So realistically, that median salary is mostly for single professionals middle

Yeah I thought that was funny because I'm as far left as it goes- I'm an anarcho communist lol. But I'm guessing because so many right wingers used inflation as a reason to blame everything on Biden, so when you bring it up people are nervous that you're some crazy Trumper. I think it's understandable, although inflation is a problem that we have to try and tackle eventually. We can't spend our way out of that one.

It’s not obtainable for most people. How are you still missing the point?

Stop talking for everyone else. It's obtainable for you. It was obtainable for poor people before because many Boston neighborhoods are where highly sought after. gentrification changed things. There are neigborhoods where low income people can afford. It may require some travel or different area but it can be done.

My parents couldnt buy in NY, so they moved to Florida. I bought in Dorchester and couldnt afford the South End. Do what you gotta do!

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550

You might be paying taxes for your entire building.

I’m not sure what interest rate you’re using but a $550k mortgage is about $3600-3800/month right now. If you’re using the estimates in Zillow the interest rates they use in their calculations are not up to date. You have to go in and change them to todays reality.

I’ve lived in boston nearly my whole life and have never lived in a single family home. At any given time boston has like 4 single family homes on the market

The Boston tax rate is about $10.50/$1,000 but the residential exemption is probably $3K total per year. It can take 1-2 years after closing for it to kick in. Bostons tax rate and exemption are great but that is primarily because the commercial tax base pays a huge part. Most suburbs don’t have that tax base diversity and soak homeowners.

Also assessed values generally lag market values by 10-20%.

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Well done, this is the dream. Is it also near the green line? And what do you get for the second apartment?

> Stop talking for everyone else

and

> There are neigborhoods where low income people can afford

What a hypocrite.

It’s near the green line. We use both sides.

Especially with work from home, it really helps having the privacy.

Damn, that’s awesome, congrats. Are you there for the duration or do you see yourself using the equity for a down payment somewhere else and renting both sides eventually? I’m curious because I bought a duplex in boston last year and am considering my long-term options.

Umm i bought in a low income neighborhood. And had to be my own handyman. Most people can do it, it takes sacrifice sometimes.

I know, that's why I literally said "my payment would be a lot worse today at market rate". Your own calculations being you to 36-3800, that's a far cry from 5-6k op is talking about. Which was exactly my point.

3200 + utilities but my place is new 2018 and has solar. Is in Quincy center

Honestly, longer term even if I move I don’t want to sell the property. I feel like I can rent it out and get the mortgage back.

I might use it as collateral to get a second mortgage if we move.

Thankfully, we are financially in a good position (touch wood!) so have the luxury of not being super fussed.

In fact our neighbor just sold and we really considered buying their place and building a new property over both. But wouldn’t have worked out now. I’m hoping in a decade or so that’s an option.

You said you couldn’t afford your house today.

No, most people cannot do it. Do you know what median household income means?

Perhaps I’m crazy but we bought in 2015 for 400k and then did a refi for 3% interest. So now we’re sitting on a house worth 950k with a mortgage balance of 250k at 3%. We want to move but literally can’t give this up without being worse off! I wonder if this is why there is no inventory in greater boston. We can’t be the only ones. And if so - it’s unlikely to change any time soon

I can't afford my house today because my house value has tripled. I could afford it when i bought it and people advised me against buying in this neighborhood in Dorchester. Today, I'd tell people to go where there opportunities are. Randolph, Lynn, Saugus, Weymouth. Just get something near a T if needed.

Edit: Two families in Hyde Park, Roslindale, Mattapan, and other places

Thanks, I feel similarly about selling and hopefully will be in a comparable position in a decade.

You can still get below 6% around here.

https://www.wrenthamcoop.com/rates

Yes, I feel safe walking to/from buses and the commuter rail. A new brewery just opened nearby and I hope it will be popular and bring foot traffic near Sprague St/Readville.

BPS students in grades K-6 are not bused "anywhere in the city." There are local catchment zones. Grades 7-12 are citywide, yes, but I don't hear many parents of exam school students declining seats there because their teenager has to commute from Charlestown to BLA.

Overwhelmingly most K-6 students will attend a public school within 2 miles of their home.

Lower income residents of Boston can apply through the Boston Home Center for reduced interest rate mortgages and up to $50,000 in down payment assistance making homes more affordable for them. It is not impossible to own a home in the City.

I know it's fixed and I do believe them. Maybe they bought points though, I never asked that. I just heard 1.8 and was too sad to continue the conversation haha

Property taxes. The difference between towns can be quite steep. I think if my place was in Nedham or Dedham I'd be paying probably 500 dollars or more monthly in taxes.

Are there homes even at that price point any more?

but i'm literally in dedham

yes, and the market has cooled off substantially you have so much more negotiating power as a buyer then I did at time of purchase