Recent comments in /f/history
Snailryder t1_j4dtn99 wrote
Reply to ‘When something like this comes up where we’re both excited, but also that sorrowful that we lost so much.’ — A Māori tribe in New Zealand is calling for the return of treasured artefacts listed for sale by the auction house Sotheby’s by marketrent
Good story. So glad that guy gave them back. Sotheby's suxks!!!
mrsandrist t1_j4dpzkp wrote
Reply to ‘When something like this comes up where we’re both excited, but also that sorrowful that we lost so much.’ — A Māori tribe in New Zealand is calling for the return of treasured artefacts listed for sale by the auction house Sotheby’s by marketrent
Sotheby’s stopped the sale of a Winslow Homer watercolour in 2011 on behalf of the Rountree/Blake family, despite them having no evidence that it had been stolen from them - no injunction, no police reports of a break in, no entry in the art loss register, basically just the assertion that it had once been in their family and now was not. Litigation is ongoing and as far as I know Sotheby’s still have possession.
Explain to me how this auction is going ahead. We know the Māori artifacts were stolen, we have precedent for the return of stolen artworks (ie nazi looting, war looting during Middle East unrest, ecc) and artefacts, we have numerous precedents for Sotheby’s seizing the assets until a legal judgement is made. Why is Sothebys doing the utmost to protect an artwork abandoned by a wealthy English family and then turning a blind eye to the wholesale cultural disenfranchisement of the Māori? Why is their disputed provenance worth halting a sale but the disputed provenance of the Māori artefacts means they can pass on good title? Bonkers.
KrispyKreme-502 t1_j4do2w1 wrote
What is the conflict between Israel and Palestine (not so much present day, but over the centuries, if that long)? Any resource suggestions?
[deleted] t1_j4dntwp wrote
Constant_Count_9497 t1_j4dnn0q wrote
Reply to comment by [deleted] in I think that the term Byzantines is rightly used for adressing the Eastern Roman Empire. by VipsaniusAgrippa25
It makes sense from the context that Byzantium was a small Roman city that Constantine turned into the cultural center of the eastern empire. At least from a chronological evaluation of the empire
[deleted] t1_j4dnjw0 wrote
LSDkiller t1_j4dmyl1 wrote
Reply to comment by stegu2 in New archival findings on the earliest ownership of the Voynich Manuscript by stegu2
This set me down a rabbit hole. I just looked at every page of the voynich and I can't see it being woman's secrets. As the author of the paper says, the longest suspected encrypted document of woman's secrets would be a maximum of six pages if it was even ever encrypted. The thing is, anything that could be said about the topic back then couldnt possibly be stretched to so many pages. Also, the drawings of the women have basically no anatomical meaning (there are no clear drawings of anatomy, or of child birth, or of any medical procedure). The drawings of the women are extremely repetitive. I can't see how information can really be encoded in them. If the tubes and such are supposed to somehow be symbolic anatomical clues, the repetitive women posing a hundred times on the page are not needed.
One thing struck me the whole time looking at those pictures: they are extemely ugly, the author couldn't draw for shit. It literally looks like how i would draw if i was trying to make something look deep and metaphorical, but didn't really have any meaning to it. There's a lot of "symmetry" and repetition in the pictures that don't seem to possibly encode information.
Then again, some illustrations are made with such detail, that it seems unlikely they aren't.
gregorydgraham t1_j4dlcnx wrote
Reply to comment by GreenThumbNZ in ‘When something like this comes up where we’re both excited, but also that sorrowful that we lost so much.’ — A Māori tribe in New Zealand is calling for the return of treasured artefacts listed for sale by the auction house Sotheby’s by marketrent
At least in Britain, a verbal contract is as good as a written one. Since the deed of gift specified the item must remain within the family, selling the taonga will restore ownership to Tūwhaere’s descendants
boluroru t1_j4dkgz1 wrote
Reply to comment by TheGreatOneSea in Simple/Short/Silly History Questions Saturday! by AutoModerator
Eh, Ksatriyas weren't ( or aren't I guess) all warriors. They were supposed to be warriors or at least rulers and administrators in theory but in practice not so much
KingToasty t1_j4dkc7z wrote
Reply to comment by akuthia in Simple/Short/Silly History Questions Saturday! by AutoModerator
The line between norms/customs and legislation/policy is very thin in some parts of the UK government. Monarchs have tried to expand their own power and it isn't successful in history. Though yes, you could technically call it a theocracy now, though it impacts governance less than the term might imply.
Fiberian_Hufky t1_j4dk1av wrote
Reply to comment by Islanduniverse in ‘When something like this comes up where we’re both excited, but also that sorrowful that we lost so much.’ — A Māori tribe in New Zealand is calling for the return of treasured artefacts listed for sale by the auction house Sotheby’s by marketrent
I'm pasting a comment I made on another post here with some links people can follow for some additional information that are less academic but still very useful.
Radio New Zealand (one of the most reputable news sources in New Zeand) report on the myth
Radio New Zealand informative video on the people and myth. Useful for a good overview
Wikipedia link on pre-colonial settlement theories of NZ
David_the_Wanderer t1_j4dj7h3 wrote
Reply to comment by GreenThumbNZ in ‘When something like this comes up where we’re both excited, but also that sorrowful that we lost so much.’ — A Māori tribe in New Zealand is calling for the return of treasured artefacts listed for sale by the auction house Sotheby’s by marketrent
The article also says that this information is based on contemporary newspapers reports, so...
RusteddCoin t1_j4divp1 wrote
Reply to I think that the term Byzantines is rightly used for adressing the Eastern Roman Empire. by VipsaniusAgrippa25
Nah i think it's dumb.
- If you're gonna call it after the capital, call it the Constantinian or the Constantinopolitan Empire, not Byzantine which is named after its old un-relevant name.
- And if you're concerned about its greek culture, then call it the Greek Empire. That's what most of Europe called it in its history.
The Byzantine name is just stupid imo.
Irichcrusader t1_j4dimlv wrote
Reply to Bookclub and Sources Wednesday! by AutoModerator
Looking for any book recommendations on the history of China from the First Opium War until the end of the cultural revolution. I'm particularly interested in anything on the political development of China, how it developed a more cohesive national identity, how it modernized, how it adapted to a more expanded world view and the arrival of foreign concepts and ideas.
More specifically, I would love to find more information (be it books, essays or anything at all) on the war lord's period, or really just anything from the revolution of 1911 until the war with Japan. Most of the books I have found on this era are out of print and/or ludicrously overpriced.
tomjonespocketrocket t1_j4dibh9 wrote
Reply to ‘When something like this comes up where we’re both excited, but also that sorrowful that we lost so much.’ — A Māori tribe in New Zealand is calling for the return of treasured artefacts listed for sale by the auction house Sotheby’s by marketrent
There is a great podcast called 'Stuff the British Stole'. Each episode focuses on a specific object but it also explores many different aspects of colonialism and how we deal with stolen artifacts. The episode titled 'The Abductions' is quite closely related to the article OP has linked to.
[deleted] t1_j4dhrtz wrote
Reply to comment by Constant_Count_9497 in I think that the term Byzantines is rightly used for adressing the Eastern Roman Empire. by VipsaniusAgrippa25
It's a delusional conversation. You're talking about a civilisation long gone in a translated language. If the perspective is what's the most respectful to the actual culture obviously use it's greek or Latin name, Eastern Roman or Byzantine or Roman Empire is irrelevant as they are all incorrect.
Constant_Count_9497 t1_j4dh98c wrote
Reply to comment by [deleted] in I think that the term Byzantines is rightly used for adressing the Eastern Roman Empire. by VipsaniusAgrippa25
I've seen a few passionate people hating the term "Byzantine" but never offering a better name
Irichcrusader t1_j4dh2lj wrote
Reply to comment by saywhar in Bookclub and Sources Wednesday! by AutoModerator
The Pursuit of Power: Europe 1815-1914, by Richard J. Evans
Constant_Count_9497 t1_j4dh1n4 wrote
Reply to comment by [deleted] in I think that the term Byzantines is rightly used for adressing the Eastern Roman Empire. by VipsaniusAgrippa25
True, they even claimed to be descendants of Anaeas. Romans were just grecophiles with a superiority complex
Irichcrusader t1_j4dgfn5 wrote
Reply to comment by Froakiebloke in Bookclub and Sources Wednesday! by AutoModerator
>Similarly, does anyone know any good political histories for late c19th European countries, esp. France Germany and Italy? I’m talking about proper high politics, prime ministers and elections etc
It's not specifically focused on that period but Diplomacy, by Henry Kissinger has a chapter that goes in great depth on the high politics of that era. Highly recommended.
LSDkiller t1_j4dga2n wrote
Reply to comment by stegu2 in New archival findings on the earliest ownership of the Voynich Manuscript by stegu2
Really though? That seems so unlikely just based on simple human nature. Why go to such a great length to encrypt it in a way that no one can understand, if you actually want it to be understood? Are any of the other examples encrypted with nearly the same amount of care? What do we know of people who would have used manuscripts like this?
Is that really what you think after working in the field so long? It seems to me that it's such a long book with such elaborate and strange drawings, how could the answer be that "simple"? The drawings especially and how no one seems to be able to decode it with their help just immediately scream "whoever made this wanted people to have a hard time reading it".
What about all the plants? Aren't many of them nonexistent? Shouldn't those that exist have some known use in women's medicine if this theory holds true?
Thanks for the study though, fascinating read.
GreenThumbNZ t1_j4dfqqf wrote
Reply to comment by David_the_Wanderer in ‘When something like this comes up where we’re both excited, but also that sorrowful that we lost so much.’ — A Māori tribe in New Zealand is calling for the return of treasured artefacts listed for sale by the auction house Sotheby’s by marketrent
So your telling me something gifted in 1886 that came with the condition that it stays in the family was told throughout generations to ensure that's the case... I think that's something that's been tacked on to try lay claim to something.
GreenThumbNZ t1_j4dv4r5 wrote
Reply to comment by David_the_Wanderer in ‘When something like this comes up where we’re both excited, but also that sorrowful that we lost so much.’ — A Māori tribe in New Zealand is calling for the return of treasured artefacts listed for sale by the auction house Sotheby’s by marketrent
He also begged that he take it. Beggers can't be choosers they say!