Recent comments in /f/history

Coachbalrog t1_ixirh2t wrote

Specifically for the case you are referring to, the Persian king Xerxes had an exiled Spartan king Demaratus as an advisor in his court. Demaratus accompanied Xerxes I on his invasion of Greece in 480 BC and is alleged to have warned Xerxes not to underestimate the Spartans before the Battle of Thermopylae.

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Odie4Prez t1_ixir95l wrote

This is mostly true, but there is at least once early reference to a place that did exist that no longer does, specifying the location of the garden of Eden. It's described as lying near the convergence of two rivers into the Tigris and Euphrates from the NE and SW that no longer exist, as the whole area has since been swallowed by the Persian Gulf. This area of Mesopotamia was likely some of the most fertile, productive land of the area with who knows how many great ancient Sumerian cities now mostly inaccessible to archaeology (for now, at least). So even in the fairly obviously non-historical parts of Abrahamic myth, there's pieces of genuine history to be found.

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belokas t1_ixiqrhu wrote

As far as I know (not much in fact) the will has been disputed, but my point here is that it's baseless to claim Columbus was Italian, when we at most can attest his birthplace (and even "Genova" could be both the city and the Republic of Genoa, so there are different cities in Liguria who claim to be his birthplace) But my point is that he basically lived his whole life in the Iberian peninsula, and never really gave any hints about being part of a different nationality. Also "nations" and national identity can't be intended in the modern sense here. Another thing is that, in his will he calls himself Colon not Colombo, as the Genoese theory claims his name should be. I think that's still a valid hypothesis, but it's far from being a historical proven fact.

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TheGrandExquisitor t1_ixiqiwz wrote

This is very common along the US Atlantic coast. The Outer Banks of S. Carolina are a good example of this. Islands come and go out there over relatively short periods. One decent storm can drastically alter the geography of the area.

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Impossible-Row-3070 t1_ixiokyz wrote

Mostly by translation. Keep in mind leaders rarely met face to face, and most communication was thus written, usually by scribes rather than the leaders themselves. A leader with a lot of resources could probably find a scribe that speaks Persian and can write in the various forms of Greek common at the time, or vice versa. Also, leaders tended to be multilingual themselves.

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-introuble2 t1_ixiocvr wrote

I don't know if this could help but, as far as I remember, regarding the Persian wars historian Herodotus sometimes is mentioning the use of interpreters [uses the word ἑρμηνεύς], while at other instances he places persons of different nations speaking directly. This underlines the possibility that he implies that they were speaking with the same language.

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starfyredragon t1_ixio995 wrote

Abrahamic history doesn't start to match real history until you get to the kingdom of Isreael period. That said it does start to match some things starting that point, so credence can be given to your point.

That said, the Sumerian version of the ark story also didn't happen. It's a story that got passed, but doesn't fit the archeology.

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TheIrises t1_ixio1a0 wrote

There are so many amazing studies on this. They actually used for the most part Native translators. It was the natives that often spoke more than one language because of the tribes always being so near to each other and consistently having to make alliances as well as war.

La Malinche is a great example of this. Although her origins remain murky she is suspected of speaking 3 native languages, Chontal Maya, Yucatec Maya, and Nahuatl, as well as Spanish. By being exposed to only new languages one will be forced to learn them. This happened to La Malinche when she was put into Cortez’ hands.

A common misconception is that the Spanish had no native help, when in reality Cortez used the already messed up relationships between the native groups to take down the Aztec Empire, which had conquered them. While there were Spanish interpreters, many were also native.

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Artanthos t1_ixinsy4 wrote

Even the Abrahamic histories are not as far off as a lot of people would wish.

Aside from religion, there is a lot of oral history there, and quite a bit of it has been verified.

To go even further. A lot of Abrahmic mythology is nothing more than Sumerian mythology that has been slightly altered.

For example, Abrahamic stories of the Great Flood come directly from the Sumerian, including their own version of the ark.

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codefyre t1_ixin69r wrote

Land drying tends to be a major cause as well. Many low-lying islands are made up of boggy sedimentary soils slowly deposited over thousands of years. Boggy soils contain a lot of water. When humans drain that soil for farming, the removal of the water allows the remaining soil to compact and settle. If the land is low enough, it can fall below the surrounding water level and the island will vanish.

The Delta in California has this issue today. When Europeans first mapped it in the 1700's, they found around 60 islands with fertile soil. The islands were surrounded by levees and farmed starting in the mid-1800's. Today, all of the islands are at least 10 feet below sea level, with some of them approaching 30 feet below sea level. Only the large modern levees and constant pumping keep them dry. Some have failed over the years, converting those islands into open water. This will likely happen to all of them over the next 100 years, allowing the San Francisco Bay to extend itself all the way into the Central Valley.

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windsingr t1_ixil59e wrote

King Leonidas: "We've been sharing our culture with you all morning."

Seriously though, much like in the modern day, there were multilingual people. And major city states and neighboring empires would keep trained citizens, slaves, and freedmen who were versed in multiple languages of important trading partners, regional powers, and potential enemies.

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