Recent comments in /f/nyc

NetQuarterLatte t1_jagsge3 wrote

Reply to comment by LearnProgramming7 in Pols target NYC’s violent, repeat shoplifters with bill to protect retailer workers just like cops, firefighters by NYY657545

That’s not really needed.

For example, people who are just stealing food to feed their family aren’t going to be assaulting anyone.

In fact, I believe if they just ask nicely or be nice about it, most retail employees would find a way to give them some food or look the other way.

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AceContinuum t1_jago714 wrote

Reply to comment by Misommar1246 in Pols target NYC’s violent, repeat shoplifters with bill to protect retailer workers just like cops, firefighters by NYY657545

>Why is everything a slippery slope to you guys? Why do we have to make laws based on some fringe incident? Some guy somewhere acts excessive so we should ignore the 99% of cases this doesn’t happen and instead make sure this one thing never ever happens again?

Are you trying to argue against the new bill on the grounds that you think it isn't necessary... because the vast majority of "repeat shoplifters" don't go around beating up retail workers?

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Misommar1246 t1_jagczl0 wrote

Reply to comment by [deleted] in Pols target NYC’s violent, repeat shoplifters with bill to protect retailer workers just like cops, firefighters by NYY657545

Why is everything a slippery slope to you guys? Why do we have to make laws based on some fringe incident? Some guy somewhere acts excessive so we should ignore the 99% of cases this doesn’t happen and instead make sure this one thing never ever happens again?

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LearnProgramming7 t1_jagbpqb wrote

Reply to comment by NetQuarterLatte in Pols target NYC’s violent, repeat shoplifters with bill to protect retailer workers just like cops, firefighters by NYY657545

The felony charge could be limited to: (1) premeditated and intentional assault against retail employees; and/or (2) aggravated assault (i.e., assault beyond pushing, non-harmful touching, etc.) committed in furtherance of theft.

That would probably give a good middle ground to avoid disproportional sentences while also still addressing the issue the bill seeks to address.

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NetQuarterLatte t1_jag7g1u wrote

Reply to comment by RedOrca-15483 in Pols target NYC’s violent, repeat shoplifters with bill to protect retailer workers just like cops, firefighters by NYY657545

They will be fear-mongering about the fascist regime the retail store security guards will impose on society.

Edit to add:

They will be trying to spread misinformation about what "assault" actually means in NY, to give the false impression that anyone can commit misdemeanor assault by doing something really minor like touching someone or slapping someone.

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NetQuarterLatte t1_jag6loh wrote

Reply to comment by [deleted] in Pols target NYC’s violent, repeat shoplifters with bill to protect retailer workers just like cops, firefighters by NYY657545

Security guards don’t do shit to be honest.

Even when they hire off duty cops, they just stand playing on their phone. It’s just for show.

Again, it appears such fear is overblown and not grounded in solid evidence.

Edit: anecdote of a single store doesn’t constitute solid evidence. The store in that anecdote you provided can be sued for damages and they will stop that real quick, if they haven’t already.

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NetQuarterLatte t1_jag5ovm wrote

Reply to comment by [deleted] in Pols target NYC’s violent, repeat shoplifters with bill to protect retailer workers just like cops, firefighters by NYY657545

I think your fear is overblown, because employees already have a big incentive to not react physically: that would violate company policy and they would just get fired.

This bill won’t fundamentally change that.

And companies implement those policies because otherwise they can be sued, say, if their guard causes or sustain injuries, making the company liable.

Edit: well, the commenter (AceContinuum) complained that people were downvoting without explaining. I provided a different viewpoint and got blocked as a result. Not the best example of open mindedness, but a representative example of ideological blindness in my opinion.

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AceContinuum t1_jag5dru wrote

Reply to comment by fakeyc in Pols target NYC’s violent, repeat shoplifters with bill to protect retailer workers just like cops, firefighters by NYY657545

How many "angry Karens" have physically assaulted store clerks and gotten away with it? Usually the "angry Karens" are loud, rude and obnoxious, but they don't tend to start throwing punches. And in the exceptions where they got physically violent, they were arrested and charged (correctly so).

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stork38 t1_jag4tps wrote

Reply to Pols target NYC’s violent, repeat shoplifters with bill to protect retailer workers just like cops, firefighters by NYY657545

This is unnecessary.

Using force while stealing property is already a serious violent crime (robbery) but "certain" DAs like to knock those down to misdemeanor petit larceny (shoplifting) instead of inconveniencing some scum violent thief with jail time.

If we had a legitimate media, they'd question how often DA's knock down these statutory felony assaults (assaults against EMS, cops, hospital workers and such) in the early stages of the case and instead just process as standard misdemeanor assaults.

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NetQuarterLatte t1_jag49l8 wrote

Reply to comment by fakeyc in Pols target NYC’s violent, repeat shoplifters with bill to protect retailer workers just like cops, firefighters by NYY657545

I think the stereotypical example is two drunks getting into a bar fight that escalated into them assaulting each other, and that putting them behind bars for 7 years would be excessive.

Edit: There's a lot of confusion about what's assault in NY law.

Two drunks just yelling and threatening each other, or even punching each other won't necessarily be enough to qualify as assault under NY Law. But if they both pull out a knife and stab each other leading to bleeding and hospitalization (intentionally causing physical injury), then that could be a misdemeanor assault.

It will only become a felony assault if the injury is serious, like with a permanent loss of an organ or limb. For example, if one them gets stabbed in the eye and loses vision, then that could qualify as felony assault.

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